[Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?

[ieck at ckt.net]

Scott, Paul or anyone else who my be interested, we have a mill we would
be willing to sell. It has not been used since ‘97 but has been under roof
for all these years. The mill is more than a hobby mill and would be more
suited for production.

 If anyone is interested, just reply and I will provide more information.

Thanks, Ivan




 Paul
>
> Where are located that you survived the sugar cane aphid?  Or did you
> spray?  I lost all my sorghum to aphid and wind.
>
> Thanks
> Scott
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 15, 2018, at 6:50 PM, Paul Lefebvre
> <paullefebvre at hotmail.com<mailto:paullefebvre at hotmail.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Thank you all for the suggestions – I’ve harvested 1/5 of my limited
> supply this year and plan, as per your suggestions, to let the stalks
> “age” for 5 days, before running though the mill.  I’ll let the juice
> settle for a day and then siphon it off before boiling doing.
>
>
>
> I’ll then compare the final product with a batch that doesn’t get the
> “ageing” treatment and see how they stack up.
>
>
>
> Thanks again to all who replied; as a beginner, I really appreciate your
> helpful feedback!
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
>
> Paul
>
> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows
> 10
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Syrupmakers
> <syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net<mailto:syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net>>
> on behalf of ieck at ckt.net<mailto:ieck at ckt.net>
> <ieck at ckt.net<mailto:ieck at ckt.net>>
> Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2018 4:49:20 PM
> To: A list for sorghum and cane syrupmakers
> Subject: Re: [Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?
>
> Paul,
>  In  regard to production loss from bacteria, there are a number of
> factors which need to be considered. Does the cane already have red rot
> problems? Does the cane have multiple cracks or is freeze damage present?
>  Just remember that anytime a stalk’s rind is breached, that is an entry
> point for bacteria.  Bacteria loves carbohydrates.
>  It was our experience, back in the 70s, that healthy cane could be stored
> 7 to 10 days with little problems.  I would not recommend storing in to
> tight a stack or in a high moisture environment.
>
>  A moderate amount of bacteria actually lowers the pH which normally
> results in a lighter syrup.
>
>  We used a rising film evaporator. This was basically a vertical shell and
> tube heat exchanger with steam around the outside of the tubes. The juice
> was pumped at a specific rate up through the tubes.  This, coupled with
> our vacuum cooker, greatly reduced the amount of time the syrup resided
> at temperatures above 160°.
>
>  There were also times we would use a centrifuge, toward the end of the
> cooking process, to clarify the syrup.
>
>  We had a lot of fun. There are times that I almost wish we were back
> make’n sorghum again.
>
> Ivan
>
>
>
>
>  Hi Ivan,
>>
>>
>>
>>   Thank you very much for such a detailed and well written reply
>> regarding
>> the DE, and suggesting vacuum evaporation.  I haven’t heard of thin film
>> evaporation, so I have some reading to do now!  Sounds like you had
>> quite a sophisticated operation.
>>
>>
>>
>> As far as letting the cut stalks “rest” before pressing – how common is
>> this practice?  I’ve heard of people doing it before, but am sure I’ve
>> read papers in the past that found this practice reduced sugar levels
>> due
>> to bacteria, which lead me to believe it wasn’t the best practice.
>>
>>
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>> Windows
>> 10
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Syrupmakers
>> <syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net<mailto:syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net>>
>> on behalf of
>> ieck at ckt.net<mailto:ieck at ckt.net> <ieck at ckt.net<mailto:ieck at ckt.net>>
>> Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2018 9:15:03 PM
>> To: A list for sorghum and cane syrupmakers
>> Subject: Re: [Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?
>>
>>
>> Hello Paul,
>>  I have not read how others have responded to your question so if I am
>> repeating please forgive.
>>  We have used literally tons of diatomaceous earth and it should be
>> viewed
>> as simply a filtering aid. In short, we would  preheat and pre-skim 1200
>> gallons of juice.  Just after this skimming process was done, we would
>> thoroughly mix 50 pounds of diatomite and keep it suspended in the juice
>> while we were pumping it through a pressure leaf filter.  This filtering
>> process left very little skimming to do on our evaporator pans.
>>  Toward the end of our sorghum making career, we were using a thin film
>> evaporation process coupled with finishing the product under 21 inches
>> of
>> vacuum.
>>  You will find that the better you clean your juice and the faster you
>> can
>> get it to 80 brix and then cooled to  160° or less, the lighter your
>> sorghum will be.  The longer your syrup stays at a temperature over 160°
>> the more it will caramelize. This caramelization will add color and
>> stronger flavors. This is why we used “thin film” and vacuum in our
>> process.
>>   I would caution against the use of any base or acid additives.  If
>> your
>> green juice becomes acidic it will produce a lighter syrup but not
>> always a desirable flavor. If you add some form of alkaline, you will
>> find that it will actually produce a darker syrup.
>>
>> Pleasant regards,
>> Ivan
>>
>>  Very interesting Gail!  I did a quick search, but couldn’t find any
>>> reference to using baking soda to help separation.  That doesn’t mean
>>> that your wrong though....anyone else have info on baking soda?
>>>
>>> Keith: I’m not quite sure what you mean by the rising of the juice.
>>> Could you expand?  If the addition of lime makes a thicker foam, which
>>> helps the separation process, then I would imagine that the baking soda
>>> addition might work in the same way, since baking soda does cause the
>>> boiling juice to foam.  How do you neutralize the alkalinity of the
>>> lime?
>>>
>>> Does anyone else have any other secrets/techniques to help in
>>> separation?
>>>
>>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>>> Windows
>>> 10
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: Syrupmakers
>>> <syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net<mailto:syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net>>
>>> on behalf of
>>> Keith
>>> Evans <dr.ofsheetrock at gmail.com<mailto:dr.ofsheetrock at gmail.com>>
>>> Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2018 9:50:15 AM
>>> To: A list for sorghum and cane syrupmakers
>>> Subject: Re: [Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?
>>>
>>> I too have heard of the use of baking soda and water added to the juice
>>> to
>>> make it rise in the kettle, if it falls. By "it" , I mean the juice
>>> when
>>> it rises. Haven't heard of baking soda being used for separation. I'm
>>> in
>>> South East Alabama.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 11:44 AM
>>> tenacity at fidnet.com<mailto:tenacity at fidnet.com><mailto:tenacity at fidnet.com>
>>> <tenacity at fidnet.com<mailto:tenacity at fidnet.com><mailto:tenacity at fidnet.com>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>  Here in the midwest I have heard of using baking soda to bring the
>>> "debris" to the top quickly. I have not tried this myself. but
>>> understand
>>> it is used by some Amish regularly. Anyone tried using it? And in what
>>> quantity for what size pan? We have both a 100 gallon and a 30 gallon
>>> batch pan. Would love to hear any experiences.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gail in Missouri
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: "Paul Lefebvre"
>>> <paullefebvre at hotmail.com<mailto:paullefebvre at hotmail.com><mailto:paullefebvre at hotmail.com>>
>>> Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2018 10:20am
>>> To: "A list for sorghum and cane syrupmakers"
>>> <syrupmakers at syrupmakers.net<mailto:syrupmakers at syrupmakers.net><mailto:syrupmakers at syrupmakers.net>>
>>> Subject: Re: [Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?
>>>
>>> Thanks for the reply Keith,
>>>
>>>     Here in Canada, pickling lime is banned as a food additive, so
>>> it’s
>>> nearly impossible to get.  ☹
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>>> Windows
>>> 10
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: Syrupmakers
>>> <syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net<mailto:syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net><mailto:syrupmakers-bounces at syrupmakers.net>>
>>> on behalf of Keith Evans
>>> <dr.ofsheetrock at gmail.com<mailto:dr.ofsheetrock at gmail.com><mailto:dr.ofsheetrock at gmail.com>>
>>> Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2018 8:04:11 AM
>>> To: A list for sorghum and cane syrupmakers
>>> Subject: Re: [Syrupmakers] Diatomaceous Earth?
>>>
>>> I've never used DE , but I use a pickeling lime at around 160° to help
>>> with separation. It causes a bigger foam (crust) for particles to get
>>> trapped in, therefore being able to remove those fine particles easier.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 11, 2018, 12:57 PM Paul Lefebvre
>>> <paullefebvre at hotmail.com<mailto:paullefebvre at hotmail.com><mailto:paullefebvre at hotmail.com>>
>>> wrote:
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>>    I was wondering if anyone on this list uses Diatomaceous Earth in
>>> their
>>> production of syrup.  Maasdam Sorghum Mill briefly mentions the
>>> addition of Diatomaceous Earth in
>>> this<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV6ztHccDy0> video at around 6:00
>>> to help remove particles, but doesn’t go into the exact specifics for
>>> using it, and was hoping I could get some feedback from anyone out
>>> there who knows more.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>>> Windows
>>> 10
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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